American hedonism closes its eyes to death, and has been
incapable of exorcising the destructive power of the moment
with a wisdom like that of the Epicureans of antiquity.

- Octavio Paz
Death is un-American, and an affront to every citizen's inalienable
right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

- Arnold Toynbee
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"As long as such self-serving hypocrisy
motivates America's response, Ukraine will
only sink further into needless bloodshed,
and that blood will be on America's head."
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In America everybody is of the opinion that he has no social superiors,
since all men are equal, but he does not admit that he has no social inferiors,
for, from the time of Jefferson onward, the doctrine that all men are equal
applies only upwards, not downwards.

― Bertrand Russell
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"What those 'racists' are reflexively and rightly reacting
to is the soulless chill as the fire goes out beneath the
melting pot. Those who think America can thrive as a
'cultural mosaic' are worse than fools; they're Canadians."

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Two centuries ago, a former European colony decided to catch up with Europe.
It succeeded so well that the United States of America became a monster,
in which the taints, the sickness and the inhumanity of Europe
have grown to appalling dimensions.

― Frantz Fanon
What the United States does best is understand itself.
What it does worst is understand others.

- Carlos Fuentes
Poor Mexico, so far from God
and so close to the United States.

- Porfirio Diaz
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"Indeed, everything about the American southland was magical
and exotic to the young Canadian musicians, from the sights
and smells to the drawling manner of speech to, especially, the
central role that music played in people’s everyday lives."

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America is a mistake, a giant mistake.
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America is an adorable woman chewing tobacco.
- Auguste Bartholdi
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mix of Nazi/Soviet bravado and 'oriental'
cunning -- easily misunderstood, and
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"And for the others who argued for English-only
patriotism, I note that there are more than
57 million Americans (about 20% of the nation)
whose first-language is not English...."

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"This is the behavior, and the fate, of paranoid
old-world tyrants like Hitler or Saddam, not liberal new-world democracies like America pretends to be."

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America is the only nation in history which
miraculously has gone directly from barbarism to
degeneration without the usual interval of civilization.

- Georges Clemenceau
I found there a country with thirty-two religions and only one sauce.
- Charles–Maurice Talleyrand
A people who are still, as it were, but in the gristle,
and not yet hardened into the bone of manhood.

- Edmund Burke
America is the only country ever founded on the printed word.
- Marshall McLuhan
"The removal of racist sports nicknames (and mascots) seems outrageously belated
-- why, exactly, has this civil rights cause
taken so long to gain momentum?"

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The atom bomb is a paper tiger which the
United States reactionaries use to scare people.
It looks terrible, but in fact it isn't.

- Mao Tse-tung
They made us many promises, more than I can remember, but
they kept only one; they promised to take our land, and they did.

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In America sex is an obsession,
in other parts of the world it is a fact.

- Marlene Dietrich
I would rather have a nod from an American,
than a snuff-box from an emperor.

- Lord Byron
One day the United States discovered it was an empire.
But it didn’t know what an empire was.
It thought that an empire was merely the biggest of all corporations.

- Roberto Calasso
Americans are so enamored of equality, they would rather
be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

- Alexis de Tocqueville
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If you are prepared to accept the consequences of your dreams
then you must still regard America today with the same naive
enthusiasm as the generations that discovered the New World.

- Jean Baudrillard
I am willing to love all mankind, except an American.
- Samuel Johnson
America, thou half brother of the world;
With something good and bad of every land.

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"What can be more powerful than disinformation in the Information Age?"
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England and America are two countries separated by the same language.
- Sir Walter Besant
Christopher Columbus, as everyone knows, is honored by
posterity because he was the last to discover America.

- James Joyce
Now, from America, empty indifferent things
are pouring across, sham things, dummy life.

- Rainer Maria Rilke
If the United States is to recover fortitude and lucidity,
it must recover itself, and to recover itself it must
recover the "others"- the outcasts of the Western world.
- Octavio Paz
The youth of America is their oldest tradition.
It has been going on now for three hundred years.

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"America really is, for most Americans, all things considered, a good place to be, and all they really want is for everyone to enjoy the same privilege and pleasure."
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America is therefore the land of the future, where, in the ages that
lie before us, the burden of the World's History shall reveal itself.

- Georg Friedrich Hegel
America is a large, friendly dog in a very small room.
Every time it wags its tail, it knocks over a chair.

- Arnold Toynbee
Americans always try to do the right thing after they've tried everything else.
- Winston Churchill
The thing that impresses me most about Americans
is the way parents obey their children.

- Edward, Duke of Windsor
Americans are apt to be unduly interested in discovering
what average opinion believes average opinion to be.

- John Maynard Keynes
Europe was created by history.
America was created by philosophy.

- Margaret Thatcher
America is God's crucible, the great Melting-Pot where all the races of
Europe are melting and reforming!... The real American has not yet arrived.
He is only in the crucible, I tell you - he will be the fusion of all races.

- Israel Zangwill
American dreams are strongest in the hearts of those
who have seen America only in their dreams.

- Pico Iyer
America: It's like Britain, only with buttons.
- Ringo Starr
The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer.
It has never yet melted.

― D.H. Lawrence
I have two conflicting visions of America.
One is a kind of dream landscape and the other is a kind of black comedy.

― Bono
The American mirror, said the voice, the sad American mirror
of wealth and poverty and constant useless metamorphosis,
the mirror that sails and whose sails are pain.

― Roberto Bolaño

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Author Topic: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"


Geoff-
Hamilton
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"Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 18, 2013, 02:15

Liu Chang, "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/indepth/2013-10/13/c_132794246.htm

I see the recent American brinkmanship on the debt ceiling as further evidence that a 'de-Americanized world,' whether desirable or not, is coming faster than many, or at least I, anticipated. What I find curious about Chang's argument, though, is the idea that the United Nations could fill the resulting power void. Isn't a de-Americanized world inevitably a (forgive the clumsy term) Chinese-ized one?



furlani
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 18, 2013, 22:02

No, if the Chinese stake in federal American debt paradoxically makes it necessary to bolster the credit of the U.S. dollar, which, unlike the U.S. state, has no legitimate rivals at all (certainly not the Chinese currency). in the "de-Americanized world," the world seems only to depend yet more on (de-)America.



laurakey
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 19, 2013, 03:01

Interesting point, Furlani - might we argue though that we can see the beginnings of a power shift in which the "image" of America is upheld and supported (e.g. as a cultural ideal) but that actual political/economic power is not necessarily synonymous with this image (an image which is now so entrenched in global culture as to be, arguably, irrevocable?).



Brian-
Jones
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 19, 2013, 08:48

Quote from Geoff Hamilton on October 18, 2013, 02:15
Liu Chang, "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/indepth/2013-10/13/c_132794246.htm

I see the recent American brinkmanship on the debt ceiling as further evidence that a 'de-Americanized world,' whether desirable or not, is coming faster than many, or at least I, anticipated. What I find curious about Chang's argument, though, is the idea that the United Nations could fill the resulting power void. Isn't a de-Americanized world inevitably a (forgive the clumsy term) Chinese-ized one?

Long-term, it sure looks like the bland congealing of former nation states (more locally and immediately in the EU, and more globally and distantly in the UN) is as inevitable as, well, Disneyland I want to say (but will seem repetitive). The geo-political world often seems to me like some monstrous science-fiction creature glomming together its heterogenous elements into a great, seamless and inescapable One (reminds me, in a weird way, of the 'white logic' of the 'Noseless One').
Thus, I think you're quite right and wrong here, Geoff: I'd say China is trying to use the UN as a lever to pry America out of the world-center, knowing that (barring some act of God) there will never be a chance again for another in that place, but preparing to form the preeminent faction in that world coalition government that has no opposition.

To furlani, I think an alternative currency (not the yuan, but a composite of the dollar, yuan, etc., and maybe gold), may happen sooner than you think. But there is a far more entrenched and only strengthening American currency, which will prove much harder to unseat...but I think I should start a new topic on this, instead of hogging this one.
(I'll call it, 'America is dead! Long live America!', and take my talkative self there immediately.)



PierreM
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 19, 2013, 14:51

Brian, I don't agree that there could never be another superpower like America. China could do it and probably will do it. Zizek talks about the rise of Asian Capitalism, which is capitalism without democracy. It's "super-charged" and, as China grows, could overwhelm American hegemony and anything the United Nations could put to rival it. I don't agree with Disneyland being inevitable, either (I'm disagreeable, I think!). Asian capitalism looks to me like the fate you say is in American Disneyland. It's China's Century, as they say.

Here's Zizek on AlJazeera (you can start paying attention closely around 11-minute mark)...
http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/talktojazeera/2011/10/2011102813360731764.html

Zizek says:.
"I think today the world is asking for a real alternative. Would you like to live in a world where the only alternative is either anglo-saxon neoliberalism or Chinese-Singaporean capitalism with Asian values?
I claim if we do nothing we will gradually approach a kind of a new type of authoritarian society. Here I see the world historical importance of what is happening today in China. Until now there was one good argument for capitalism: sooner or later it brought a demand for democracy...
What I'm afraid of is with this capitalism with Asian values, we get a capitalism much more efficient and dynamic than our western capitalism. But I don't share the hope of my liberal friends - give them ten years, [and there will be] another Tiananmen Square demonstration - no, the marriage between capitalism and democracy is over." Slavoj Zizek



Esther-
Cheong
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 20, 2013, 01:20

As other forum members have mentioned, I do believe that the power dynamics that we had taken for granted since the Cold War has and will continue to change drastically, what with debt within the US rising to ever higher heights and no one can argue against China's economic growth in the past 10 years.

However to speak of China as a super power, one has to approach this with a clean slate. What I mean by this, is that one has to wipe clean the normalised ideal and conception of the American model. To say China will never take America's place as a super power is correct in some sense in that China will most likely develop its own unique model. Looking at PierreM's quote from Aljazeera "Chinese-Singaporean capitalism with Asian values" is an expected and almost feared outcome. Cold War sensibilities regarding communism shrouds this prediction with trepidation. But what is to say that this model is negative? True, it would not live up to the "image" America has built around it's cultural identity as pointed out by laurakey. However it might be a stretch to assume that the new society would stay a fully authoritarian one. According to BBC's Simon Jack, "entrepreneurs is the highest form of life" in developing China:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_9778000/9778527.stm

With more and more people looking to start businesses of their own, innovation will inevitably follow. The authoritarian system of government would have to loosen its hold to accommodate economic growth. So if this turns out to be the case, "Chinese-Singaporean capitalism with Asian Values" might not be such a bad idea.



Brian-
Jones
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 20, 2013, 05:28

Capitalism? Did you say Capitalism, my good friends? Let me shake your hands, please come this way, and welcome to the Church of America! Don't be put off by the external trappings; we're not put off by yours--you can't judge a book by it's cover, right?--we are a liberal, ecumenical faith, embracing all forms of expression, so long as they share our common commitment to Life, Equity, and the Pursuit of Happiness, which you, brothers and sisters, clearly do.
And we won't let a trivial thing like language come between us in our common pursuit, will we? when we all share the far more important, dependable and convertible currency of yuan and cents?
Do our modes of government seem different? Well let us ask them both what they're for. Will they not both answer, with one voice, 'The material--and of course spiritual--welfare of our people! A high standard of living, security and peace for all, access to universal education and competent affordable health care, etc. (We bore easily with the details.)' And will they not be equally right?
Sure there's a bit of a gap there between your rich and your poor, but we're closing on you as fast as we can.
And the human rights thing, well, who's perfect? Of the 30 paragraphs of the universal charter of human rights, drafted at the time of our Eleanor Roosevelt (complete coincidence!), we ourselves are violating 10 (at last count). The question is, can we deal here! And the answer is clearly 没错!Tiananmen is so eighties. A few years, a few more million millionaires, a few more inches on the middle-class waistband, and you too will have Guantanamo! How many years and internet wonders before the Ministry of State Security can afford the subtley, the sophistication and the interior decoration--the style--of the NSA?
Because after all, it's all about style, isn't it?
Life style.
And when your air's a little cleaner, your shops a little trendier, your airwaves a little livelier, your bikes collapsible (Boris is a shyster, don't trade with him!) and your bars open all night, I'll think I was in Houston. Texas values may not be Asian values, just yet, but hell, I'd way prefer Shanghai to San Francisco!
The China Century?
Go for it, hot dog!



Geoff-
Hamilton
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 20, 2013, 15:40

And yet, Uncle Sam (Brian), you won't think you're in Houston if "undemocratic Chinese capitalism" straitjackets your pursuit of happiness. I'm with Zizek here (and, I think, Pierre, laurakey, and Esther) on recognizing the important and intriguing differences between what America seems to want the rest of the world to share, and what an authoritarian regime (however committed to super-charged capitalism) might allow. Uncle Sam, says Brian (I think), will eventually dissolve that authority -- tempting the masses with pleasures they can't resist, and prompting democratic reforms that go at least so far as to permit the free indulgence in them -- but I think this underestimates the power of a state that learns to harness all the totalitarian techniques of supervision and manipulation pioneered by the corporations. Zizek's example about the (alleged) Chinese ban on reading time-travel fiction ("They have banned fictional works considering alternative worlds"; thanks, Pierre!) seems like a forbidding indication of how Houston -- or all of Houston -- is not heading to Shanghai anytime soon.



Brian-
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: October 21, 2013, 01:23

Anytime soon is right!
And till then, an Other! ah, the blissful tangibility of authoritarianism, the impressive warnings and high stakes, the cinematic values! They're banning books, god bless 'em!



Wyatt Dick
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: November 13, 2013, 12:50

Looking at the Chinese comments from a more real politik angle, China's intentions have always seemed fairly clear to me. They are perfectly happy dissembling publicly and taking pot shots at America when they can. But what they really want right now is to be left alone to grow. China has no desire to take over or even share America's "indispensable" role in world affairs. Not yet. And no one would be more alarmed than China if America actually followed the advice put forward in Chinese rhetoric and started the de-Americanization of the world with any speed. China needs the stability that American power brings to the world economy so that China can keep growing, and it doesn't want to dilute its focus on that growth by sharing in any of these responsibilities at the moment.
However, China does like it when America is occupied elsewhere and unable to focus on keeping China contained in Asia. Despite public protests to the contrary, China has been tickled pink that the US has spent the last 10 years (and several trillion dollars) bogged down in the Middle East. What China wants is a slow, gradual decline of American influence that gives China increasing room to maneuver in Asia, while not requiring any Chinese investment in maintaining the World Order until they are ready.



Geoff-
Hamilton
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: November 15, 2013, 01:01

I'm definitely no expert here, but reckon it worth adding to Wyatt's convincing argument above that while China may be content to stand aside and let America 'bog down' in the Middle East, it has certainly taken a leading role in Africa (which gets, of course, comparatively little attention from the U.S.).

From a recent article on Africa.com (http://www.africa.com/blog/making_the_most_of_chinese_aid_to_africa/)...

The People’s Republic of China started engaging with African countries not long after it was founded. Since the Bandung Conference, in 1955, its activities in Africa have been rooted in their common experience as developing regions. From then onward, China has committed aid and support to various African leaders and countries, despite its own economic and political challenges and upheavals. With inventive packages of aid, loans, and investments, the People’s Republic, in return, secured votes to take China’s seat at the United Nations (held by Taiwan’s government until 1971), opened up channels for much-needed oil and mineral resources, mitigated its food-security concerns, and gained a strategic foothold on the continent.

Even in 1978, when China was just emerging from the devastating effects of its Cultural Revolution and was itself one of the world’s poorest countries, it provided foreign aid to 74 countries—and to more in Africa than the United States did. By 1984, China was the eighth-largest bilateral donor to sub-Saharan Africa, ranking higher than many members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD). From 2002 to 2007, China offered over $33 billion worth of government-sponsored aid and investment, over half for infrastructure projects, to African countries. Today the continent is dotted with Chinese-sponsored projects, from railways to agricultural centers to clinics to stadiums.



Wyatt Dick
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Re: "Commentary: U.S. fiscal failure warrants a de-Americanized world"
on: November 15, 2013, 08:52

China's Africa policies seem typical of their approach: spread some money around, secure some access to oil, but don't become involved in anything that you can't easily walk away from. I'm not necessarily impugning their motives for providing aid, and I think anyone who acts with generosity should be applauded for it. I'm just saying that the kind of commitment China is making in Africa is on a far different level than America's commitments in the Middle East or South East Asia, to take just two examples.

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