American hedonism closes its eyes to death, and has been
incapable of exorcising the destructive power of the moment
with a wisdom like that of the Epicureans of antiquity.

- Octavio Paz
Death is un-American, and an affront to every citizen's inalienable
right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

- Arnold Toynbee
the_band_huge
the_band_huge
"As long as such self-serving hypocrisy
motivates America's response, Ukraine will
only sink further into needless bloodshed,
and that blood will be on America's head."
JOIN THE DISCUSSION
the_band_huge
In America everybody is of the opinion that he has no social superiors,
since all men are equal, but he does not admit that he has no social inferiors,
for, from the time of Jefferson onward, the doctrine that all men are equal
applies only upwards, not downwards.

― Bertrand Russell
Global Coke
Global Coke
"What those 'racists' are reflexively and rightly reacting
to is the soulless chill as the fire goes out beneath the
melting pot. Those who think America can thrive as a
'cultural mosaic' are worse than fools; they're Canadians."

JOIN THE DISCUSSION
Global Coke
Two centuries ago, a former European colony decided to catch up with Europe.
It succeeded so well that the United States of America became a monster,
in which the taints, the sickness and the inhumanity of Europe
have grown to appalling dimensions.

― Frantz Fanon
What the United States does best is understand itself.
What it does worst is understand others.

- Carlos Fuentes
Poor Mexico, so far from God
and so close to the United States.

- Porfirio Diaz
the_band_huge
the_band_huge
"Indeed, everything about the American southland was magical
and exotic to the young Canadian musicians, from the sights
and smells to the drawling manner of speech to, especially, the
central role that music played in people’s everyday lives."

JOIN THE DISCUSSION
the_band_huge
America is a mistake, a giant mistake.
- Sigmund Freud
America is an adorable woman chewing tobacco.
- Auguste Bartholdi
chimerica
chimerica
"This is the tone of the China Century, a subtle
mix of Nazi/Soviet bravado and 'oriental'
cunning -- easily misunderstood, and
never
heard before, in a real enemy, by the West."

JOIN THE DISCUSSION
chimerica
Coke and 'America the Beautiful'
Coke and 'America the Beautiful'
"And for the others who argued for English-only
patriotism, I note that there are more than
57 million Americans (about 20% of the nation)
whose first-language is not English...."

JOIN THE DISCUSSION
Coke and 'America the Beautiful'
predator-firing-missile4
predator-firing-missile4
"This is the behavior, and the fate, of paranoid
old-world tyrants like Hitler or Saddam, not liberal new-world democracies like America pretends to be."

JOIN THE DISCUSSION
predator-firing-missile4
America is the only nation in history which
miraculously has gone directly from barbarism to
degeneration without the usual interval of civilization.

- Georges Clemenceau
I found there a country with thirty-two religions and only one sauce.
- Charles–Maurice Talleyrand
A people who are still, as it were, but in the gristle,
and not yet hardened into the bone of manhood.

- Edmund Burke
America is the only country ever founded on the printed word.
- Marshall McLuhan
"The removal of racist sports nicknames (and mascots) seems outrageously belated
-- why, exactly, has this civil rights cause
taken so long to gain momentum?"

JOIN THE DISCUSSION
The atom bomb is a paper tiger which the
United States reactionaries use to scare people.
It looks terrible, but in fact it isn't.

- Mao Tse-tung
They made us many promises, more than I can remember, but
they kept only one; they promised to take our land, and they did.

- Red Cloud
In America sex is an obsession,
in other parts of the world it is a fact.

- Marlene Dietrich
I would rather have a nod from an American,
than a snuff-box from an emperor.

- Lord Byron
One day the United States discovered it was an empire.
But it didn’t know what an empire was.
It thought that an empire was merely the biggest of all corporations.

- Roberto Calasso
Americans are so enamored of equality, they would rather
be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

- Alexis de Tocqueville
newtown
newtown
"No one, I thought, could watch those scenes, of young children slaughtered en masse, and so many parents grieving, without thinking that this, finally, would tip some kind of balance in the country."
JOIN THE DISCUSSION
newtown
If you are prepared to accept the consequences of your dreams
then you must still regard America today with the same naive
enthusiasm as the generations that discovered the New World.

- Jean Baudrillard
I am willing to love all mankind, except an American.
- Samuel Johnson
America, thou half brother of the world;
With something good and bad of every land.

- Philip Bailey
"What can be more powerful than disinformation in the Information Age?"
JOIN THE DISCUSSION
England and America are two countries separated by the same language.
- Sir Walter Besant
Christopher Columbus, as everyone knows, is honored by
posterity because he was the last to discover America.

- James Joyce
Now, from America, empty indifferent things
are pouring across, sham things, dummy life.

- Rainer Maria Rilke
If the United States is to recover fortitude and lucidity,
it must recover itself, and to recover itself it must
recover the "others"- the outcasts of the Western world.
- Octavio Paz
The youth of America is their oldest tradition.
It has been going on now for three hundred years.

- Oscar Wilde
"America really is, for most Americans, all things considered, a good place to be, and all they really want is for everyone to enjoy the same privilege and pleasure."
JOIN THE DISCUSSION
When good Americans die they go to Paris;
when bad Americans die they go to America.

- Oscar Wilde
jobs drug dealer
jobs drug dealer
They're nothing more than traffickers; and as the smart traffickers'll tell you, you don't use the merchandise. They are just inoculating their kids with a tech-drug serum, to immunize them against the very merchandise that put the **** bowling alley in their basement.
jobs drug dealer
America is therefore the land of the future, where, in the ages that
lie before us, the burden of the World's History shall reveal itself.

- Georg Friedrich Hegel
America is a large, friendly dog in a very small room.
Every time it wags its tail, it knocks over a chair.

- Arnold Toynbee
Americans always try to do the right thing after they've tried everything else.
- Winston Churchill
The thing that impresses me most about Americans
is the way parents obey their children.

- Edward, Duke of Windsor
Americans are apt to be unduly interested in discovering
what average opinion believes average opinion to be.

- John Maynard Keynes
Europe was created by history.
America was created by philosophy.

- Margaret Thatcher
America is God's crucible, the great Melting-Pot where all the races of
Europe are melting and reforming!... The real American has not yet arrived.
He is only in the crucible, I tell you - he will be the fusion of all races.

- Israel Zangwill
American dreams are strongest in the hearts of those
who have seen America only in their dreams.

- Pico Iyer
America: It's like Britain, only with buttons.
- Ringo Starr
The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer.
It has never yet melted.

― D.H. Lawrence
I have two conflicting visions of America.
One is a kind of dream landscape and the other is a kind of black comedy.

― Bono
The American mirror, said the voice, the sad American mirror
of wealth and poverty and constant useless metamorphosis,
the mirror that sails and whose sails are pain.

― Roberto Bolaño

April 15, 2024

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Author Topic: How Dare You Marginalize My Favourites? / The Black Gatsby


rizwanzara
Novice Their American
Posts: 8
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How Dare You Marginalize My Favourites? / The Black Gatsby
on: November 4, 2015, 13:16

The prospect of Jay Gatsby being a man of colour initially left me raising an eyebrow, unable to determine how anyone could read the novel and interpret Gatsby to be anything but a white man. Throughout my reading of The Great Gatsby I had pictured Gatsby as white (okay, as Leonardo DiCaprio), just as the vast majority of people seemed to. But when I began to really think about the titular character being a man of colour who possessed the privilege of passing as white, I realized just how plausible the concept was.

Carlyle Thompson, professor of African American and American Literature at Medgar Evers College was the first person to suggest the interpretation of black Gatsby, regarding his cropped cut to be reminiscent of a black man’s hair, Gatsby’s mansion residing on 40 acres of land just as freed slaves were promised 40 acres, and of course Tom’s confrontation of Gatsby, subtly accusing him of being a black individual when he asserts that interracial marriage will destroy the sanctity or family life. Jordan, to Gatsby's defense, states "We're all white here." But are we really?

I’m certain that, regardless of this evidence, many people will still roll their eyes, will dismiss, or even express anger towards the interpretation. But in response, I quote Thompson: “When I ask people what basis there is for Gatsby being white, I get silence. I have asked students, colleagues. They don’t know. They cannot give me any evidence to back up the speculation.” (http://www.salon.com/2000/08/09/gatsby/)

The fact of the matter is simply that the Eurocentric society of America enforces us to view whiteness as the default. I recall a personal anecdote where I was reading a childhood book and had pictured a character as white until three chapters in, when the character was described as having “chocolate coloured skin.” I myself am a person of colour, however growing up in Canada (which I believe is just as Eurocentric as America) has ingrained in me to view whiteness as the norm (something which I struggle to deconstruct in my day to day life.)

But this is why the suggestion of favourite characters being anything but the norm is such a shock. This is why, when actor Donald Glover desired to pursue the role of Peter Parker and created the #DonaldForSpiderman hashtag, he was met with thousands of tweets calling him the n-word and expressing disgust towards the idea of a black Spiderman. Glover ignored the slurs, yet became infuriated when someone messaged him stating, as if it were a fact, “the thing about it is there’s no black kids like Peter Parker.” Glover responded with his frustrations, questioning us that “it’s fucking 2011 and you don’t think there’s a black kid that lives with his aunt in Queens? Who likes Science, who takes photography?” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lgko-xReFSs)

Why is the prospect of our favourite characters being marginalized so difficult to cope with? Why do we immediately disregard Gatsby as black, why do we raise an eyebrow at Nick being anything but heterosexual, why do we detest the marginalized? Why is a mere interpretation enough to instill anger and hatred within ourselves? I believe that the answer to this is the Eurocentricism of America (along with heteronormativity in regards to Nick’s sexuality, but that’s another topic), but I’m interested in hearing why others do or do not believe that Gatsby could, in fact, be a black man.



jennynicol-
le
Novice Their American
Posts: 8
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Re: How Dare You Marginalize My Favourites? / The Black Gatsby
on: November 22, 2015, 13:28

I agree that Western society enforces this view of “whiteness” as the default; my own personal view of the character of Gatsby was always him as a white man as well. However, the idea of Gatsby as an African American is really interesting, and seems reasonable once you analyze certain aspects of the story. For example the point in which Tom is speaking about the book “The Rise of the Colored Empire” Jordan quickly states “we’re all white here”. Until this point I have never placed any particular emphasis on this statement, but in context of the scene it seems rather peculiar. It is almost as if she is reassuring the individuals at the table that everyone is of the same race, but why does she do this? Jordan was also constructed to be a liar in the novel.
Another relevant fact was pointed out by my Professor about the popular music of the time period which was jazz. Even though jazz music was deeply embedded within the African American culture, white people were constantly attending events where jazz music was played. My professor pointed out how it was strange that Gatsby’s parties were frequently attended, but Gatsby was not playing the most popular music of the era. It is plausible that this was one of the ways he was trying to detach himself from his initial identity as an African American man. He may of been trying to do so he could be more appealing to Daisy, and the white, upper class she was identified with.
It also makes sense that Gatsby could potentially be identified as an African American if you think about his character and its association to the modernist movement of the time. Gatsby has always been understood as a figure of the roaring twenties, in which economic growth and prosperity could be attained. However, Gatsby could have also been a symbol for the reconstruction of the African American identity.

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